flu vaccine II

Dec 9, 2008, 2:15 pm by Lew

Here is a nice citation about mass flu vaccination Over the last seven years Ontario gave free influenza vaccinations to everyone over 6 months old. The rest of Canada, like the USA, continued population targeted vaccinations. In Ontario the number of influenza related deaths and hospital visits went down dramatically compared to the rest of the country.

The Effect of Universal Influenza Immunization on Mortality and Health Care Use

The results of this large-scale natural experiment suggest that universal

vaccination may be an effective public health measure for reducing the annual

burden of influenza.

I can't find the link but the cdc is adding people 6 months to 18 years old to the targeted vaccination group. Not because they are vulnerable but because school children are a major vector pool for influenza.

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10 Comments

vince Says:

Dec 9, 2008

Lewis, this paper is speculation upon speculation upon poop. If you have four groups of people: babies, grade-school children, adults, and seniors, I would say to give vaccines to the youngest and the oldest. From reading the paper, I agree that grad-school children are probably a good idea if your county, school district, whatever has enough funds to vaccinate a mass aggregation of booger-eating, bubble-gum spitting children. They are disgusting and the cesspool they call public school probably has all sorts of aids and epidemics waiting to happen. Here is my problem: mass vaccination of something that is almost as genetically variant as the common cold is ridiculous. Sure, some more stable vaccines I'm all for, as they can eradicate more genetically stable pathogens. But you must remember this, you can't eradicate the flu, just like you can't cure cancer. Trying to get rid of "this season's" flu with anything other than your own immune system makes a larger population vulnerable to variants. Do you know how the flu changes? Have you taken a virology class? I'm not trying to argue, I'm just trying to get you away from this notion that "OMG EVERYONE HATES SCIENTISTS AND DOESN'T TRUST THEM." The majority of the world is still sending stupid chain letters about goblins trying to infect your soul unless you send the letter to 20 people you know within 5 minutes. And if you do, your life is saved by a magical dwarf named Hieronymus who sprinkles a magical mixture of stardust and Keebler elf cookies.

vince Says:

Dec 9, 2008

god, I hate the formatting of this comment box corrections: "I would say, "give vaccines to the youngest and the oldest."" "I agree that vaccinating grade-school children is probably a good idea if your county, school district, or whatever..."

vince Says:

Dec 9, 2008

may I use html?

c'mon, what is this?

zach Says:

Dec 10, 2008

flu vaccines are stupid. all it does is select for more variable strains. lew, don't you have a degree in biology or something?

zach Says:

Dec 10, 2008

vince, close your html tags

LEW Says:

Dec 11, 2008

I thought you sir had a biology degree. The vaccine does not select for more variable strains. It selects against the common strains (the one that kills around 500,000 people a year). Just because people are not getting the common strain does not mean that rare strains will start running rampant. Rare variable strains will remain rare. They are rare for a reason. Immunizing the population for one strain does not some how allow the others to run rampant. influenza is serious disease that we could be doing more to combat. Also, if there were fewer people coming down with influenza there wouldn't be as many strains!

Vince Says:

Dec 11, 2008

I could totally see you talking to Rachel in your living room, while she reassures you that you're right and we're wrong.

Also, your alarmist figure of 500,000 doesn't mention that its worldwide, of people that are immuno compromised that are probably dying of aids, cancer, and poverty.

It is about 36,000 people that die in the US (http://www.cdc.gov/flu/keyfacts.htm), and those are people that should be the vaccine, but don't.

Lewis, the flu has a fragmented chromosome, each which encode glycoproteins. It isn't like small pox but also isn't like HIV.

LEW Says:

Dec 11, 2008

I am pretty sure Rachel disagrees with me. But thank you. It is not alarmist it one of the top 10 killers of people. That is a shit load of people and we can do something about it. In addition to being a potentially deadly disease it also costs our economy billions yearly in lost labor. My point is that getting the vaccine doesn't hurt you and it could help all the people you come in contact with. What is your point? I know that influenza is not in the same family.

LEW Says:

Dec 11, 2008

I'll e-mail Dr. Krug. If he is against population wide vaccination I'll concede.

LEW Says:

Dec 11, 2008

dr. krug e-mailed. you both are trolling aren't you.

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